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Post by michaelcasselman on Oct 27, 2024 19:35:50 GMT -5
[shrug} It is what it is.
As a listener, you go into the 4 hour hours thinking you're getting (whatever year is being offered).
If it's a deliberate choice, or a trend, it's a curious one that breaks the verisimilitude of going back to (whatever year is being offered), much like if a comparable H3S1 from another weeks show was played in place of H3S1 of (whatever year is being offered)
If it's an accident, every station is prone to it: it could be due to a glitchy download, or someone's on vacation that week or, as is prone to happen, another indeterminate software malfunction.
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Post by K.M. Richards on Oct 27, 2024 23:47:17 GMT -5
Yes, as I said previously, it was a deliberate choice on my part, and I have at least been honest in saying so and explaining why I make these choices.
But the affiliation agreement with Premiere does not have a verisimilitude clause, and even if it did, it would only likely apply to the program itself. Even Larry Morgan calls them "extras" and a station is not required to carry them. (In fact, the only legal requirement is to carry the 15 minutes of national advertising during the show.)
I'm sorry you don't like it, but -- again, as I already said -- the question may become academic if I lose those minutes to advertising that has to be shifted from earlier in the day.
At least I am honest.
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Post by michaelcasselman on Oct 28, 2024 9:58:03 GMT -5
Because of the logistics involved in my being a remote program director, I tend to schedule the music for KRKE before Premiere issues the cue sheets. Thankfully, I can use the original cue sheets from Shannon Lynn's site to avoid conflicts within the show itself ... because that does not change. But I do not generally know for certain what the extras will be until the week before the show. (And you all know as well as I that there is never a guarantee that Premiere will keep all the extras from the last time a particular program aired.) I recall in previous years that affiliate stations had access to the Premiere cuesheets (some stations even had posted them as an attachment to their 'Casey/AT40" pages on their stations websites). Are they not provided anymore, or are they a separate download... if they are still available, how early would a station be able to get them? And since it's been a while that I've seen a station continuing this practice, does Premiere have a prohibition against posting their cuesheets? I know I've (and many of us on here have noted in the past) heard several stations that have had the issue that you strive to avoid... just finished listening to a countdown, and then within a half-hour you hear one of the last songs played on that countdown as part of the station's regular rotation. In a time when there are complaints about songs being played too often in a rotation (especially if you spend a few hours in a row listening to some satellite stations), I completely understand the reluctance to get called out on that sort of thing. |
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Post by mkarns on Oct 28, 2024 10:31:53 GMT -5
Scheduled for November 8-10: November 17, 1984.
That would appear to fit the following week's dates better, so it indicates that something dated after 11/17 will be played then. I'd guess November 19, 1983, as 1983 is the year that hasn't been an A or standalone in the longest (since August.) 11/22/80 and 11/21/87 are also possible.
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Post by LC on Oct 28, 2024 11:34:11 GMT -5
What is this week's show?
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Post by mkarns on Oct 28, 2024 11:37:37 GMT -5
What is this week's show? November 2, 1985. |
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Post by K.M. Richards on Oct 28, 2024 12:31:41 GMT -5
Because of the logistics involved in my being a remote program director, I tend to schedule the music for KRKE before Premiere issues the cue sheets. Thankfully, I can use the original cue sheets from Shannon Lynn's site to avoid conflicts within the show itself ... because that does not change. But I do not generally know for certain what the extras will be until the week before the show. (And you all know as well as I that there is never a guarantee that Premiere will keep all the extras from the last time a particular program aired.) I recall in previous years that affiliate stations had access to the Premiere cue sheets (some stations even had posted them as an attachment to their 'Casey/AT40" pages on their stations websites). Are they not provided anymore, or are they a separate download... if they are still available, how early would a station be able to get them? And since it's been a while that I've seen a station continuing this practice, does Premiere have a prohibition against posting their cuesheets? I know I've (and many of us on here have noted in the past) heard several stations that have had the issue that you strive to avoid... just finished listening to a countdown, and then within a half-hour you hear one of the last songs played on that countdown as part of the station's regular rotation. In a time when there are complaints about songs being played too often in a rotation (especially if you spend a few hours in a row listening to some satellite stations), I completely understand the reluctance to get called out on that sort of thing.
Okay, we're back to questions I can answer, and I'm happy to do so, because -- let's face it -- Premiere isn't motivated to answer listener inquiries.
Affiliate stations get the cue sheets on either the Monday or Tuesday prior to the week's show. They are in a folder on Premiere's FTP server that stations access via password-protected login. (Each station also has two folders for downloading the show itself, which is normally available by the end of the business day on Tuesday; one is the main folder and the other is in a separate subfolder on the server and used during weeks that there are "B" shows.) The bonus shows that Premiere gives affiliates are in another folder which any station can access when logged in.
We also (no surprise) have an affiliate guide, in PDF format. It contains the FTP server information, mostly for the use of new affiliates who need to configure their FTP downloading software, contact numbers/e-mails at Premiere, and one page that lists all the scheduled shows for the year (for both the 70s and 80s versions), which weeks will have "B" shows and which dates those will be, and when there will be bonus shows. And before you ask: Yes, every classic AT40 affiliate has known since January which year will be the year-end countdown. We are very good at keeping that secret, as Premiere expects us to.
So, if I need to know what is going to be scheduled in advance to avoid the music scheduling conflicts that I outlined previously, I can do one of two things: Either access Shannon Lynn's repository of the original cue sheets at his Charis Music site (which I know you all regularly also access), or if for some reason that's not working for me, I can use my Record Research book of reprints of every Hot 100 chart in the 80s. As you might guess, I prefer using the original cue sheets because I then also know the LDDs and those extras which were embedded into the original broadcasts, but either way I at least know what the 40 songs in the countdown will be and can then schedule the rest of Sunday's music on KRKE to avoid conflicts. I still have to wait for the cue sheets to know what the extras will be; usually they are the same as the last time a specific show airs (and thank you, lasvegaskid , for including that in your announcements) but as we all know, Premiere does sometimes change those (especially if someone died and they replace an extra for a tribute). So part of my decision about which extras to run is going to be based on which songs don't conflict with whatever I have scheduled.
BTW, I have on a few occasions used the "wrong year" extra because of an artist's passing. I did that the weeks when Henry Fambrough of the Spinners left us and when Duke Fakir of the Four Tops went to rock and roll heaven ... both of those weeks, I ran the "B" show but used those extras from the "A". (See, my doing that isn't always as bad as you might think!)
Now, as I mentioned previously, that page in the affiliate guide with the list of the year's shows has, in big red letters at the top, DO NOT POST ONLINE OR SOCIAL – INTERNAL USE ONLY FOR MUSIC SCHEDULING AND WEEK-OF PROMOTION. That language essentially makes it a legal requirement that we not share it other than to announce the immediately upcoming program. By extension, the Premiere cue sheets are considered to be proprietary information, protected by language in the affiliation agreement, and those stations that used to make those available to their listeners were undoubtedly told by Premiere to cease and desist that practice.
Thanks, michaelcasselman , for acknowledging the importance of avoiding the scheduling conflicts. Just as a listener, that would annoy me, so you can imagine how much more annoyed I am hearing that as a programmer. So I make the extra effort, if for no other reason than it improves my chances of keeping the audience after the countdown ends.
Okay, I think we're all caught up on this issue, and I have a Monday full of station-related stuff to do, so I'll just wish you all a good week, and keep reaching for the stars, of course ...
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Post by K.M. Richards on Oct 28, 2024 13:18:22 GMT -5
Scheduled for November 8-10: November 17, 1984. That would appear to fit the following week's dates better, so it indicates that something dated after 11/17 will be played then. I'd guess November 19, 1983, as 1983 is the year that hasn't been an A or standalone in the longest (since August.) 11/22/80 and 11/21/87 are also possible. Without getting on Premiere's hit list for revealing too much, your guess is incorrect but one of your two alternate possibles is correct. |
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Post by dukelightning on Oct 28, 2024 14:00:55 GMT -5
As frequently as 1983 has been offered as an A show not only this year but over all the years, I never would have guessed that it would get to the point of having the longest drought of any year and still not being the year presented when it appeared most likely to be played. Not only that, both 1981 and 1984 are being presented only 4 weeks after their last presentations. Tough to predict for those of you that do so huh!
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Post by listenerwants2know on Oct 28, 2024 14:20:35 GMT -5
[...] Tough to predict for those of you that do so huh! But isn´t it precisely this aspect that makes the whole thing exciting and provides a bit of variety ?
Here´s a post about the station Super 80s ( www.super80s.at/), which was launched in Austria by KroneHit in June 2024: The initial joy of rarely played tracks is gone so quickly when the same "rarely played" tracks are repeated day in, day out. At first you think to yourself: wow, someone´s playing "Human League - Being Boiled", but then it´s played all the time. Presumably a rotation of 100-200 tracks with a few "rarely played" tracks among them, which then also come on all the time. Too bad, another missed opportunity ! So it´s back to Spotify after all ! Because people won´t listen to such programs anyway because of the terribly exciting moderation. |
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Post by K.M. Richards on Oct 28, 2024 18:06:11 GMT -5
The initial joy of rarely played tracks is gone so quickly when the same "rarely played" tracks are repeated day in, day out. At first you think to yourself: wow, someone´s playing "Human League - Being Boiled", but then it´s played all the time. Presumably a rotation of 100-200 tracks with a few "rarely played" tracks among them, which then also come on all the time. In a nutshell, you just explained my reasoning in having my "Forgotten 45" feature air a limited number of titles over a three-week period, bouncing them all over the schedule and replacing one-third of them every week, then mandating a minimum of six months' rest before any song can have another active period.
"OhmygodIhaven'theardthatsonginages" is a much better listener reaction than "that song again?"
BTW, I have 125 songs in my power rotation alone, about twice as many as secondaries, plus another 60 or so that were big MTV New Wave hits. Then add in the Forgotten 45 and the 400 or so classic New Wave/Modern Rock songs I program "Flashback Weekend" with and you can see the balance between consensus listener favorites and too small an active library.
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Post by listenerwants2know on Oct 29, 2024 1:59:28 GMT -5
The initial joy of rarely played tracks is gone so quickly when the same "rarely played" tracks are repeated day in, day out. At first you think to yourself: wow, someone´s playing "Human League - Being Boiled", but then it´s played all the time. Presumably a rotation of 100-200 tracks with a few "rarely played" tracks among them, which then also come on all the time. In a nutshell, you just explained my reasoning in having my "Forgotten 45" feature air a limited number of titles over a three-week period, bouncing them all over the schedule and replacing one-third of them every week, then mandating a minimum of six months' rest before any song can have another active period.
"OhmygodIhaven'theardthatsonginages" is a much better listener reaction than "that song again?"
BTW, I have 125 songs in my power rotation alone, about twice as many as secondaries, plus another 60 or so that were big MTV New Wave hits. Then add in the Forgotten 45 and the 400 or so classic New Wave/Modern Rock songs I program "Flashback Weekend" with and you can see the balance between consensus listener favorites and too small an active library.
My post was a listener reaction to the Super 80s station ( www.super80s.at/) in Austria. |
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Post by OnWithTheCountdown on Oct 29, 2024 7:14:32 GMT -5
That second weekend in November is tricky when scheduling 1984; it would always have to be a week ahead or a week behind for Premiere, since Charlie Van Dyke hosted the 11/10/1984 show (which I'll be hearing next month in my 1983-1984 AT40 run).
Par for the course this time of year.
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Post by K.M. Richards on Oct 29, 2024 11:05:19 GMT -5
My post was a listener reaction to the Super 80s station ( www.super80s.at/) in Austria. From the description you gave, they aren't doing a very good job of it. The "deep track" by the Human League should be in a category like my Forgotten 45, where it plays for a limited period of time, is then replaced by another song, and given a decent rest period before returning to active rotation.
I doubt Austria's listeners are any more tolerant of overplaying lesser songs than are U.S. listeners.  |
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Post by listenerwants2know on Oct 29, 2024 12:27:26 GMT -5
My post was a listener reaction to the Super 80s station ( www.super80s.at/) in Austria. From the description you gave, they aren't doing a very good job of it. The "deep track" by the Human League should be in a category like my Forgotten 45, where it plays for a limited period of time, is then replaced by another song, and given a decent rest period before returning to active rotation.
I doubt Austria's listeners are any more tolerant of overplaying lesser songs than are U.S. listeners. I don´t believe that either. I just keep noticing that, on the one hand, there´s always a call for more variety and, on the other hand, even if there is a slight drift away from the "everyday" mainstream, there´s also a call for "more familiar" songs.
But let´s take an example of an artist whose music is "naturally" well known both in America and in Austria: Prince And let´s limit ourselves to the presumably best-known songs from the decade of the 80s.
Which of the following songs should be in an A-rotation and why should this or that song perhaps not be in rotation at all ? I would be very interested in an answer to this question.
Here´s the list - not chronologically, but alphabetically: 1999 - Alphabet St. - Batdance - Delirious - I Could Never Take The Place Of Your Man - I Would Die 4 U - Kiss - Let´s Go Crazy - Little Red Corvette - Mountains - Pop Life - Purple Rain - Raspberry Beret - Sign "o" the Times - Take Me With U - U Got The Look - When Doves Cry |
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