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Post by doofus67 on Dec 17, 2023 23:29:36 GMT -5
That would be cool, but it's so hard to quantify. Some labels had a pattern of hitting higher peaks in other trades, such as Motown in Cash Box or, to a lesser extent, Atlantic in Record World. Hard to quantify, but not impossible. A spreadsheet with the three surveys of the Wardlow Era, then sorting the records that suffered the most in Billboard compared to CB and RW, then sorting the greatest sufferers list (maybe 100 records?) by record label, then compare THAT list to a record label sort of all the records. Call it the Rafferty List. Gee, is that all? I'll make some calls and see what I can whip up. Watch this space. |
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Post by lasvegaskid on Dec 22, 2023 15:45:48 GMT -5
I always questioned Lennon getting to #1 then falling to #12 after only three weeks in the top 10. To me, that seemed like a way to create a historical event of having each Beatle collect a solo #1. And then a couple week's later during a free fall, didn't Whatever... mysteriously pause at #40 so each Beatle could have a solo hit in the top 40 at the same time creating another history making moment? Last week's 1979 show I wonder if Casey subtly acknowledged the invalidity of this in answering a letter about all 4 ex Beatles in the top 40 at the same time. He mentioned the two weeks in 1975, but omitted 12/14/74 where Whatever mysteriously stalled. |
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Post by lasvegaskid on Dec 31, 2023 12:58:20 GMT -5
A taste of what was to come? The 1/12/80 chart had Heartache Tonight making a gargantuan drop 99-34 while other former biggies around it; Tusk, Dim All The Lights and Herb Alpert were either on the Rise or holding.
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Post by vince on Dec 31, 2023 15:39:55 GMT -5
A taste of what was to come? The 1/12/80 chart had Heartache Tonight making a gargantuan drop 99-34 while other former biggies around it; Tusk, Dim All The Lights and Herb Alpert were either on the Rise or holding. All the mentioned song fell off the chart the following week. "Heartache Tonight" may have dropped because station were playing "The Long Run". |
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Post by lasvegaskid on Mar 17, 2024 13:33:30 GMT -5
This week in 1981 JT started a mysterious trend that lasted until early 1983 with tunes debuting on the Hot 100 in the 20s/ 30s but stalling before becoming a top tenner like Her Town Too did faltering at #11.
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Post by Hervard on Mar 17, 2024 15:06:17 GMT -5
This week in 1981 JT started a mysterious trend that lasted until early 1983 with tunes debuting on the Hot 100 in the 20s/ 30s but stalling before becoming a top tenner like Her Town Too did faltering at #11. What other songs did that besides "Her Town Too", "It's Raining Again" and "All Right"? |
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Post by lasvegaskid on Jul 27, 2024 17:13:21 GMT -5
This week in 1982 began a trend & I wonder if it was the beginning of the end for our buddy Billboard Bill. Songs dropping from the teens all the way of out of the top 40. And it only got more ridiculous as 1982 wrapped up. Soon top tenners were doing the same and tunes in the teens would be in the 70s the next week.
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Post by mga707 on Jul 27, 2024 19:55:19 GMT -5
This week in 1981 JT started a mysterious trend that lasted until early 1983 with tunes debuting on the Hot 100 in the 20s/ 30s but stalling before becoming a top tenner like Her Town Too did faltering at #11. What other songs did that besides "Her Town Too", "It's Raining Again" and "All Right"? Vegaskid states it is a 'mysterious' trend, but not necessarily a common one.  But it was more common in the early '80s than it had been in prior AT40 years. |
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Post by doofus67 on Jul 27, 2024 21:32:07 GMT -5
What other songs did that besides "Her Town Too", "It's Raining Again" and "All Right"? Vegaskid states it is a 'mysterious' trend, but not necessarily a common one. But it was more common in the early '80s than it had been in prior AT40 years. However rare or common the trend was, I doubt that it belongs in this thread. Of the two elements in play, the missing-the-top-ten part looks relatively organic. The songs by James and JD, Supertramp, and Christopher Cross were obviously instant adds at a majority of the panel stations. Just one guy's opinion, but that had little to do with how popular they actually were at that early stage. Besides, none of those songs could have struck very many people as the kind that they would feel compelled to run to the record store and plunk down $1.99 for at first listen. That made their low peaks very understandable. The high-debut element, admittedly, is questionable. For any song to jump on to the chart at such a high level, it should have had to get strong sales out of the box in that first week. The early '80s were a point in time when the Hot 100 was still weighted more heavily towards sales than airplay. Right? |
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Post by djjoe1960 on Jul 28, 2024 5:57:50 GMT -5
Vegaskid states it is a 'mysterious' trend, but not necessarily a common one. But it was more common in the early '80s than it had been in prior AT40 years. However rare or common the trend was, I doubt that it belongs in this thread. Of the two elements in play, the missing-the-top-ten part looks relatively organic. The songs by James and JD, Supertramp, and Christopher Cross were obviously instant adds at a majority of the panel stations. Just one guy's opinion, but that had little to do with how popular they actually were at that early stage. Besides, none of those songs could have struck very many people as the kind that they would feel compelled to run to the record store and plunk down $1.99 for at first listen. That made their low peaks very understandable. The high-debut element, admittedly, is questionable. For any song to jump on to the chart at such a high level, it should have had to get strong sales out of the box in that first week. The early '80s were a point in time when the Hot 100 was still weighted more heavily towards sales than airplay. Right? I doubt songs that had high debuts in the late '70's and early '80's were based on sales but more likely how many radio stations added a song the first week or two it came out. More than likely sales would lag behind a week or two and one of the easiest ways to check this out would be to look at the Radio & Records chart and compare the debuts on that chart with where a song debuted in Billboard or Cash Box. |
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Post by doofus67 on Jul 28, 2024 22:51:51 GMT -5
I doubt songs that had high debuts in the late '70's and early '80's were based on sales but more likely how many radio stations added a song the first week or two it came out. More than likely sales would lag behind a week or two and one of the easiest ways to check this out would be to look at the Radio & Records chart and compare the debuts on that chart with where a song debuted in Billboard or Cash Box. Sure, I can do that. Let's cover the last five years of Bogus Bill's reign of terror (May 1978 through April 1983), and let's include everything that debuted within the top 50 in Billboard, regardless of peak position. | Song | BB debut/date | CB debut/date | R&R debut/date | | "You Don't Bring Me Flowers" | #48, 10/28/78 | #57, 10/28/78 | #27, 11/4/78 | | "Too Much Heaven" | #35, 11/18/78 | #27, 11/18/78 | #26, 11/18/78 | | "Da Ya Think I'm Sexy?" | #40, 12/23/78 | #47, 12/23/78 | #26, 12/30/78 | | "Tragedy" | #29, 2/10/79 | #32, 2/10/79 | #26, 2/10/79 | | "Sultans of Swing" | #47, 2/10/79 | #61, 2/3/79 | #30, 2/17/79 | | "Goodnight Tonight" | #38, 3/31/79 | #41, 3/31/79 | #30, 3/31/79 | | "Love You Inside Out" | #37, 4/21/79 | #39, 4/21/79 | #26, 4/21/79 | | "Don't Bring Me Down" | #41, 8/4/79 | #48, 7/28/79 | #28, 8/4/79 | | "The Long Run" | #33, 12/8/79 | #57, 12/1/79 | #24, 12/8/79 | | "Sara" | #45, 12/15/79 | #43, 12/15/79 | #27, 12/15/79 | | "Desire" | #44, 1/26/80 | #49, 1/26/80 | #30, 1/26/80 | | "Hurt So Bad" | #46, 4/12/80 | #57, 4/5/80 | #28, 4/12/80 | | "It's Still Rock and Roll to Me" | #38, 5/24/80 | #43, 5/24/80 | #25, 5/24/80 | | "Love the World Away" | #44, 6/21/80 | #58, 6/14/80 | #28, 6/21/80 | | "Emotional Rescue" | #33, 7/5/80 | #44, 7/5/80 | #27, 7/12/80 | | "Late in the Evening" | #46, 8/9/80 | #33, 8/9/80 | #27, 8/9/80 | | "Real Love" | #40, 9/6/80 | #31, 9/6/80 | #25, 9/6/80 | | "Woman in Love" | #49, 9/6/80 | #34, 9/6/80 | #29, 9/6/80 | | "The Wanderer" | #43, 9/20/80 | #44, 9/20/80 | #30, 9/20/80 | | "Lady" | #39, 10/4/80 | #31, 10/4/80 | #29, 10/4/80 | | "Love on the Rocks" | #32, 11/1/80 | #36, 11/1/80 | #23, 11/8/80 | | "(Just Like) Starting Over" | #38, 11/1/80 | #41, 11/1/80 | #25, 11/8/80 | | "Hungry Heart" | #30, 11/8/80 | #37, 11/8/80 | #30, 11/1/80 | | "Tell It Like It Is" | #41, 11/22/80 | #40, 11/22/80 | #27, 11/22/80 | | "Passion" | #40, 11/22/80 | #49, 11/22/80 | #28, 11/29/80 | | "Woman" | #36, 1/17/81 | #51, 1/17/81 | #30, 1/17/81 | | "The Best of Times" | #31, 1/24/81 | #31, 1/24/81 | #27, 1/24/81 | | "Crying" | #37, 1/24/81 | #43, 1/24/81 | #30, 1/24/81 | | "Hello Again" | #32, 1/31/81 | #36, 1/31/81 | #30, 1/31/81 | | "Her Town Too" | #38, 3/14/81 | #39, 3/14/81 | #29, 3/14/81 | | "All Those Years Ago" | #33, 5/23/81 | #25, 5/23/81 | #28, 5/23/81 | | "I Don't Need You" | #33, 6/13/81 | #34, 6/13/81 | #29, 6/13/81 | | "Share Your Love with Me" | #47, 9/5/81 | #59, 9/5/81 | #30, 9/12/81 | | "Waiting for a Girl Like You" | #42, 10/10/81 | #57, 10/10/81 | #27, 10/10/81 | | "Ebony and Ivory" | #29, 4/10/82 | #30, 4/10/82 | #28, 4/10/82 | | "Hold Me" | #33, 6/19/82 | #35, 6/19/82 | #30, 6/19/82 | | "Wasted on the Way" | #48, 6/26/82 | #52, 6/26/82 | #27, 7/3/82 | | "It's Raining Again" | #31, 10/30/82 | #44, 10/30/82 | #28, 11/6/82 | | "The Girl Is Mine" | #45, 11/6/82 | #39, 11/6/82 | #28, 11/13/82 | | "Shame on the Moon" | #40, 12/18/82 | #51, 12/18/82 | #23, 12/25/82 | | "Stray Cat Strut" | #43, 12/25/82 | #78, 12/25/82 | #29, 1/15/83 | | "You Are" | #49, 1/15/83 | #54, 1/15/83 | #30, 1/22/83 | | "All Right" | #29, 1/22/83 | #44, 1/22/83 | #26, 1/29/83 | | "Billie Jean" | #47, 1/22/83 | #65, 1/22/83 | #23, 2/5/83 | | "We've Got Tonight" | #36, 1/29/83 | #38, 1/29/83 | #30, 1/29/83 | | "Separate Ways" | #36, 2/5/83 | #58, 2/5/83 | #30, 2/12/83 | | "Mr. Roboto" | #40, 2/12/83 | #49, 2/12/83 | #29, 2/19/83 | | "Overkill" | #28, 4/9/83 | #38, 4/9/83 | #30, 4/9/83 |
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Post by doofus67 on Aug 18, 2024 22:30:11 GMT -5
I don't know if this might be a chart manipulation but on this week's 6/17/78 countdown, there are ten songs between #20 and #34 which all move up six notches. Huh?!?! It doesn't make sense that songs like "Miss You", which would go on to hit #1, would move up the same number of notches as songs like "I Was Only Joking" which would only reach #22. Maybe this example falls under the category of "Chart Boredom" instead of "Chart Manipulations" but I find it hard to believe that all of these songs would magically move up the same number of notches. Certainly boredom, but also Bogus Bill's star criteria at the time, as shown below each week's chart. Songs in the 21-30 range earned a star by moving up six spots. Officially, that is. We all know that those parameters were broken more often than they were followed. |
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Post by doofus67 on Sept 22, 2024 18:35:24 GMT -5
I don't know if this might be a chart manipulation but on this week's 6/17/78 countdown, there are ten songs between #20 and #34 which all move up six notches. Huh?!?! It doesn't make sense that songs like "Miss You", which would go on to hit #1, would move up the same number of notches as songs like "I Was Only Joking" which would only reach #22. Maybe this example falls under the category of "Chart Boredom" instead of "Chart Manipulations" but I find it hard to believe that all of these songs would magically move up the same number of notches. Certainly boredom, but also Bogus Bill's star criteria at the time, as shown below each week's chart. Songs in the 21-30 range earned a star by moving up six spots. Officially, that is. We all know that those parameters were broken more often than they were followed. File this under W for "Why didn't I think of it sooner?" Was Bill bored? 😜 OK, file it under D for "dad joke." Or B for "bad joke." |
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Post by doofus67 on Sept 22, 2024 18:47:56 GMT -5
I don't know if this might be a chart manipulation but on this week's 6/17/78 countdown, there are ten songs between #20 and #34 which all move up six notches. Huh?!?! It doesn't make sense that songs like "Miss You", which would go on to hit #1, would move up the same number of notches as songs like "I Was Only Joking" which would only reach #22. Maybe this example falls under the category of "Chart Boredom" instead of "Chart Manipulations" but I find it hard to believe that all of these songs would magically move up the same number of notches. Certainly boredom, but also Bogus Bill's star criteria at the time, as shown below each week's chart. Songs in the 21-30 range earned a star by moving up six spots. Officially, that is. We all know that those parameters were broken more often than they were followed. Just to clarify, Bill seemed to be under pressure, probably self-inflicted, to consistently, from week to week, award a star to as many songs/artists/labels as possible. Long gone was the "Super Seven" concept of mid-1973, which limited star designation to the seven hottest records below #30 on any given chart. |
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But it was more common in the early '80s than it had been in prior AT40 years. 