A Difference in WT40 and CT40

[Glass Joe]

When studying the year end lists of both Rick Dees Top 40 and Casey’s Top 40, I noted this:

Their lists for the years 1990 to 1993 are exactly the same.
However, the lists from 1994 to 1997 are different from each other.

The biggest difference was 1994, where Casey’s list had a lot more Alternative Rock songs that missed Dees. The 1995 to 1997 ones are closer, but a lot of songs are in different places.
Being that they both used the R&R charts, why do you think they ended up with different year end lists, but only in the mid 90s and not the early 90s too? Tough to figure out.

[Hervard]

May 25, 2024 13:55:11 GMT -5 Glass Joe said:

When studying the year end lists of both Rick Dees Top 40 and Casey’s Top 40, I noted this:

Their lists for the years 1990 to 1993 are exactly the same.
However, the lists from 1994 to 1997 are different from each other.

The biggest difference was 1994, where Casey’s list had a lot more Alternative Rock songs that missed Dees. The 1995 to 1997 ones are closer, but a lot of songs are in different places.
Being that they both used the R&R charts, why do you think they ended up with different year end lists, but only in the mid 90s and not the early 90s too? Tough to figure out.

In 1994, though both countdowns used R&R's charts for the weekly chart, Rick went with R&R's Top 94 of 1994 for his year-ender. Casey used a list that looked like it may have been a Mediabase list that ran from January 1 through mid-December. The reason for that was because R&R's Top 94 used the mixed chart (Rhythmic and Mainstream) that would eventually be discontinued at the end of 1994 and contained many songs that were never played on either show, while the two subcharts did not have a printed year-end list at all. I'm guessing that Rick used R&R's list so he'd be able to use the rap/hip-hop songs that never made the Top 40 as songs that he could skip over (as it was tough to cram 47 songs into four hours, especially two weeks in a row). Starting in mid-1995, Rick started using his own chart that seemed to favor R&B songs (at first, I thought it was what the mixed chart would look like had it continued into 1995) and that lasted through mid-1997. I'm guessing that had something to do with how his year-enders were different for those years. Moreover, Rick's chart of 1998 was close to R&R's, with a few positions switched as well, though I think it resembled R&R's chart more than the previous three years. As for 1999, he did the Top 80 songs of the 1990s over two weeks and did not do a 1999 chart at all (though I do believe that at the beginning of the Top 100 of 2000, he recapped the Top Five of that year, using R&R's chart).

[Glass Joe]

Thanks! That does make more sense now. I like the lineup on Casey’s Mediabase ‘94 year end list that ran through mid-December. That explains why so many songs from late ‘94 that peaked in December made the list.
I am disappointed Rick Dees never did a 1999 year end show. He should have even at least made time for a Top 50 of the year. That’s cool that he recapped it anyway.

[Hervard]

I definitely preferred the list that Casey used. There were so many songs on the R&R Top 94 of 1994 that I had never heard before (and, of course, it stayed that way, as Rick, sure enough, skipped over every song that never made the Top 40 - and even a few that did).

You mentioned how songs that peaked in December made the list. On the other side of the coin, there were a few songs from earlier in the year that did not quite make the list - ones that would have had the survey period included December, 1993 ("I Can See Clearly Now" is the one that stands out in my mind). That's why I surmised that it was a Mediabase list (since their survey period begins January 1). I remember being surprised when Casey said, when plugging the year-end show, that "You Want This" by Janet Jackson was going to be one of the songs on the list, since I had made a prediction chart (using the December-November survey period that R&R had gone by for years) and that song was predicted to be #100 (as it turned out, it came in not too much higher on Casey's chart).

1999 was not the first year that Rick skipped doing a year-end show in favor of one for the decade - at the end of 1989, he did the exact same thing that he did in 1999 - a Top 80 of the 1980s and no year-ender (and that 80s show, which I heard about 13 years ago was very shabbily done).

[Mike]

May 25, 2024 14:19:46 GMT -5 Hervard said:

In 1994, though both countdowns used R&R's charts for the weekly chart, Rick went with R&R's Top 94 of 1994 for his year-ender. Casey used a list that looked like it may have been a Mediabase list that ran from January 1 through mid-December. The reason for that was because R&R's Top 94 used the mixed chart (Rhythmic and Mainstream) that would eventually be discontinued at the end of 1994 and contained many songs that were never played on either show, while the two subcharts did not have a printed year-end list at all. I'm guessing that Rick used R&R's list so he'd be able to use the rap/hip-hop songs that never made the Top 40 as songs that he could skip over (as it was tough to cram 47 songs into four hours, especially two weeks in a row). Starting in mid-1995, Rick started using his own chart that seemed to favor R&B songs (at first, I thought it was what the mixed chart would look like had it continued into 1995) and that lasted through mid-1997. I'm guessing that had something to do with how his year-enders were different for those years. Moreover, Rick's chart of 1998 was close to R&R's, with a few positions switched as well, though I think it resembled R&R's chart more than the previous three years. As for 1999, he did the Top 80 songs of the 1990s over two weeks and did not do a 1999 chart at all (though I do believe that at the beginning of the Top 100 of 2000, he recapped the Top Five of that year, using R&R's chart).

Any possibility that CT40 used the R&R Mainstream Top 100 for 1994? Just that, as you said, R&R never specifically printed that list - wouldn't preclude them still giving CT40 the list to use for the countdown.

[OnWithTheCountdown]

May 25, 2024 16:28:22 GMT -5 Hervard said:

I definitely preferred the list that Casey used. There were so many songs on the R&R Top 94 of 1994 that I had never heard before (and, of course, it stayed that way, as Rick, sure enough, skipped over every song that never made the Top 40 - and even a few that did).

You mentioned how songs that peaked in December made the list. On the other side of the coin, there were a few songs from earlier in the year that did not quite make the list - ones that would have had the survey period included December, 1993 ("I Can See Clearly Now" is the one that stands out in my mind). That's why I surmised that it was a Mediabase list (since their survey period begins January 1). I remember being surprised when Casey said, when plugging the year-end show, that "You Want This" by Janet Jackson was going to be one of the songs on the list, since I had made a prediction chart (using the December-November survey period that R&R had gone by for years) and that song was predicted to be #100 (as it turned out, it came in not too much higher on Casey's chart).

1999 was not the first year that Rick skipped doing a year-end show in favor of one for the decade - at the end of 1989, he did the exact same thing that he did in 1999 - a Top 80 of the 1980s and no year-ender (and that 80s show, which I heard about 13 years ago was very shabbily done).

I heard Dees' 80s and 90s decade shows for the first time very early this year, and the 80s one wasn't good at all. There was so much extra content, he was falling behind. I think at the midpoint of the show, he was at #26 or #25. I'm thinking, something's gotta give somewhere, he's way off. Well, sure enough, it did...in the top ten. He skipped #'s 6, 5, 4, and 3.

His 90s show was much better. Still, it stinks that the two years ending in "9" got the shaft on a year-end countdown. Shouldn't have to be that way. Who knows if that happened in 2009 and 2019 also. Thankfully, all years ending in "9" still had a year-end countdown for AT40/CT40.

[Hervard]

May 25, 2024 17:22:17 GMT -5 Mike said:

Any possibility that CT40 used the R&R Mainstream Top 100 for 1994? Just that, as you said, R&R never specifically printed that list - wouldn't preclude them still giving CT40 the list to use for the countdown.

Given the survey period which, as stated before, ran from January 1 through sometime in December, I doubt it (as they resumed using the December-November time frame the following year and used it for years afterward).

[dth1971]

May 25, 2024 13:55:11 GMT -5 Glass Joe said:

When studying the year end lists of both Rick Dees Top 40 and Casey’s Top 40, I noted this:

Their lists for the years 1990 to 1993 are exactly the same.
However, the lists from 1994 to 1997 are different from each other.

The biggest difference was 1994, where Casey’s list had a lot more Alternative Rock songs that missed Dees. The 1995 to 1997 ones are closer, but a lot of songs are in different places.
Being that they both used the R&R charts, why do you think they ended up with different year end lists, but only in the mid 90s and not the early 90s too? Tough to figure out.

I thought in 1995-1997 Rick Dees temporary abandoned the R&R CHR Pop chart source for his own chart.

[Hervard]

May 25, 2024 20:27:17 GMT -5 OnWithTheCountdown said:

May 25, 2024 16:28:22 GMT -5 Hervard said:

I definitely preferred the list that Casey used. There were so many songs on the R&R Top 94 of 1994 that I had never heard before (and, of course, it stayed that way, as Rick, sure enough, skipped over every song that never made the Top 40 - and even a few that did).

You mentioned how songs that peaked in December made the list. On the other side of the coin, there were a few songs from earlier in the year that did not quite make the list - ones that would have had the survey period included December, 1993 ("I Can See Clearly Now" is the one that stands out in my mind). That's why I surmised that it was a Mediabase list (since their survey period begins January 1). I remember being surprised when Casey said, when plugging the year-end show, that "You Want This" by Janet Jackson was going to be one of the songs on the list, since I had made a prediction chart (using the December-November survey period that R&R had gone by for years) and that song was predicted to be #100 (as it turned out, it came in not too much higher on Casey's chart).

1999 was not the first year that Rick skipped doing a year-end show in favor of one for the decade - at the end of 1989, he did the exact same thing that he did in 1999 - a Top 80 of the 1980s and no year-ender (and that 80s show, which I heard about 13 years ago was very shabbily done).

I heard Dees' 80s and 90s decade shows for the first time very early this year, and the 80s one wasn't good at all. There was so much extra content, he was falling behind. I think at the midpoint of the show, he was at #26 or #25. I'm thinking, something's gotta give somewhere, he's way off. Well, sure enough, it did...in the top ten. He skipped #'s 6, 5, 4, and 3.

Those were hardly the only songs he skipped over. There were two other cases in Part 2 alone in which four songs in a row were skipped (though Rick did play drop pieces of them). In place of these, he played big hits from 1989 which begs the question - why the heck did he not just do a Top 40 of 1989 one week and a Top 40 of the decade the next? What's the point in doing a huge top hits of the decade countdown if you're going to skip over so many of them. Pretty much defeats the whole purpose.

[Hervard]

May 26, 2024 6:57:24 GMT -5 dth1971 said:

I thought in 1995-1997 Rick Dees temporary abandoned the R&R CHR Pop chart source for his own chart.

May 25, 2024 14:19:46 GMT -5 Hervard said:

In 1994, though both countdowns used R&R's charts for the weekly chart, Rick went with R&R's Top 94 of 1994 for his year-ender. Casey used a list that looked like it may have been a Mediabase list that ran from January 1 through mid-December. The reason for that was because R&R's Top 94 used the mixed chart (Rhythmic and Mainstream) that would eventually be discontinued at the end of 1994 and contained many songs that were never played on either show, while the two subcharts did not have a printed year-end list at all. I'm guessing that Rick used R&R's list so he'd be able to use the rap/hip-hop songs that never made the Top 40 as songs that he could skip over (as it was tough to cram 47 songs into four hours, especially two weeks in a row). Starting in mid-1995, Rick started using his own chart that seemed to favor R&B songs (at first, I thought it was what the mixed chart would look like had it continued into 1995) and that lasted through mid-1997. I'm guessing that had something to do with how his year-enders were different for those years. Moreover, Rick's chart of 1998 was close to R&R's, with a few positions switched as well, though I think it resembled R&R's chart more than the previous three years. As for 1999, he did the Top 80 songs of the 1990s over two weeks and did not do a 1999 chart at all (though I do believe that at the beginning of the Top 100 of 2000, he recapped the Top Five of that year, using R&R's chart).

[Glass Joe]

May 25, 2024 20:27:17 GMT -5 OnWithTheCountdown said:

May 25, 2024 16:28:22 GMT -5 Hervard said:

I definitely preferred the list that Casey used. There were so many songs on the R&R Top 94 of 1994 that I had never heard before (and, of course, it stayed that way, as Rick, sure enough, skipped over every song that never made the Top 40 - and even a few that did).

You mentioned how songs that peaked in December made the list. On the other side of the coin, there were a few songs from earlier in the year that did not quite make the list - ones that would have had the survey period included December, 1993 ("I Can See Clearly Now" is the one that stands out in my mind). That's why I surmised that it was a Mediabase list (since their survey period begins January 1). I remember being surprised when Casey said, when plugging the year-end show, that "You Want This" by Janet Jackson was going to be one of the songs on the list, since I had made a prediction chart (using the December-November survey period that R&R had gone by for years) and that song was predicted to be #100 (as it turned out, it came in not too much higher on Casey's chart).

1999 was not the first year that Rick skipped doing a year-end show in favor of one for the decade - at the end of 1989, he did the exact same thing that he did in 1999 - a Top 80 of the 1980s and no year-ender (and that 80s show, which I heard about 13 years ago was very shabbily done).

I heard Dees' 80s and 90s decade shows for the first time very early this year, and the 80s one wasn't good at all. There was so much extra content, he was falling behind. I think at the midpoint of the show, he was at #26 or #25. I'm thinking, something's gotta give somewhere, he's way off. Well, sure enough, it did...in the top ten. He skipped #'s 6, 5, 4, and 3.

His 90s show was much better. Still, it stinks that the two years ending in "9" got the shaft on a year-end countdown. Shouldn't have to be that way. Who knows if that happened in 2009 and 2019 also. Thankfully, all years ending in "9" still had a year-end countdown for AT40/CT40.

I heard his format was weird for the 80s show, where he only played snippets of a lot of songs. I did hear his 90s decade end show recently too, and I definitely enjoyed it. It was balanced, no songs were skipped, and no years were left out. Unlike on his 2000s decade end show, where there were no songs even on the list at all from 2000 or 2001. Very strange. He did actually do a 2009 year end, but it was only a Top 50 or Top 40. I forget which. But, doing a 2009 year end unfortunately limited his decade show to just a Top 40. Having a 2 part Top 80 for the 90s was much better. One of the features of the 90s decade show that stood out to me was at the end of each of the 8 hours, he did a "time capsule" segment summing up each decade from the 20s to the 90s. Snippets from popular movies from each decade and some song clips (random ones too, not necessarily the most popular ones) and having that feature made it feel like a really unique show.