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Post by blackbowl68 on Aug 7, 2013 11:59:34 GMT -5
Going back to the original issue of this topic, ABC Records listed most of the singles for this Chicago based group as "Rufus featuring Chaka Khan" in the 1970s. I think they did that because she was not the original primary voice of the group on their first album.
Also, the Partridge Family used the featuring credit for Shirley Jones AND David Cassidy on most of their first season singles.
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Post by tpanther775 on Aug 7, 2013 12:56:25 GMT -5
Woolebull, your right about Joe Pizzulo. If it wasn't for him, Sergio wouldn't have had those two hits back in 1983 and 1984. Always liked "Alibis". That song never gets any airplay anymore. Last time I heard that on the radio was back in mid 1990's on a AC station in Raleigh/Durham area. In another thread, I mentioned how Daft Punk had one of the biggest lapses in time between their first and second Top 40 hits. What I failed to bring up is that any time you have a composer of music, it is easier to fit into the next era of music (Santana, Sergio, and Daft Punk come to mind) than say someone who sings from another era. What I like about singles now is that, unlike in the time of 1983 or so when people like Joe Pizzulo got no credit at all for a song, Pharrell gets credit for, "Get Lucky". If it wasn't for Pharrell (and Nile Rodgers of course) that song is not nearly as popular. And I love, "Alabis", tpanther...I'm sure you heard it on Mix 101.5 Yeah woolebull, i'm sure it was 101.5. I broke off of listening to G105 when I got out of high school. It took me forever to figure out who sung that song back then. Now to reply about singles crediting more now than in the 80's. I'm all for giving credit where credit is due. But it's gone to new lengths now. I mean there are so many songs that are like that, they have 2 to 5 different ones on each single sometimes. I don't know if you have any of Joel Whitburn's books but I got the second most recent Top Pop Singles that goes until 2011 and the credit they give is out of control. Of course i'm getting older and can't stand the music of today so i'm set in my ways. But that's my opinion. Problem is I have to hear it a lot since I have a teenage son that's always booming up the neighborhood with his system in his car. I'm trying to get my youngest son into the music I like. So far he is liking it but i'm sure that will change.
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Post by Mike on Aug 7, 2013 15:17:33 GMT -5
I think James Ingram should have gotten more credit on the song "One Hundred Ways" in 1982. I know it's Quincy Jones featuring James Ingram. But that song is James' just as much as Quincy's. I always thought James is a great singer. It's amazing he had only one solo hit. I think in the case of Quincy, that was just his style, to (unlike Herb) list the singers of the songs with "featuring" credits, since...correct me if I'm wrong, but Quincy didn't actually sing on his songs, did he? Or if he did, it was the exception.
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Post by mga707 on Aug 7, 2013 16:19:01 GMT -5
How was "Diamonds" credited? For the longest time I always thought it was a Janet Jackson solo hit. But later in life I always saw it as Herb Albert featuring Janet Jackson. Janet got the Sergio treatment on "Diamonds". Full credit goes to Herb Alpert. Not even a "feature". I seem to recall that Miss Jackson (if you're nasty ) wished to remain uncredited on "Diamonds", as she was riding high with all of hits from "Control" at the time. Kind of similar to her brother's earlier uncredited vocal assistance on Rockwell's "Somebody's Watching Me".
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Post by mstgator on Aug 7, 2013 19:45:52 GMT -5
How was "Diamonds" credited? For the longest time I always thought it was a Janet Jackson solo hit. But later in life I always saw it as Herb Albert featuring Janet Jackson. Janet got the Sergio treatment on "Diamonds". Full credit goes to Herb Alpert. Not even a "feature". And Lisa Keith got screwed out of label credit on both "Diamonds" and its followup, "Making Love In The Rain".
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Post by woolebull on Aug 7, 2013 20:58:32 GMT -5
Janet got the Sergio treatment on "Diamonds". Full credit goes to Herb Alpert. Not even a "feature". I seem to recall that Miss Jackson (if you're nasty ) wished to remain uncredited on "Diamonds", as she was riding high with all of hits from "Control" at the time. Kind of similar to her brother's earlier uncredited vocal assistance on Rockwell's "Somebody's Watching Me". I wonder if Madonna did the same with "Sidewalk Talk" and Jellybean?
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Post by adam31 on Aug 10, 2013 0:31:08 GMT -5
How was "Diamonds" credited? For the longest time I always thought it was a Janet Jackson solo hit. But later in life I always saw it as Herb Albert featuring Janet Jackson. Janet got the Sergio treatment on "Diamonds". Full credit goes to Herb Alpert. Not even a "feature". Exactly, Janet is not mentioned in the artist credit for "Diamonds". I remember when that song first came out, I knew 99% it was Janet. The only confirmation I got though was weeks later on AT40 when Casey later told the story about how Herb being Janet's boss in a way. Lisa Keith, the other female singer on the song, evenutally got her top 40 due with 1993's "Better Than You" (#12 on AT40, and #36 on BB Hot 100). Fun fact: For the first time, Janet Jackson included the song on her 2011 tour, Number Ones: Up Close and Personal. Oh and btw, James Ingram is incredible. One of the best voices ever.
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Post by woolebull on Aug 10, 2013 8:17:45 GMT -5
I was listening to a 1988 show and heard "She's Like The Wind" from Patrick Swayze featuring Wendy Fraser. I know it's common to have "featuring" credits now, but during the classic AT40 era was Wendy the biggest artist whose only Top 40 appearance was a "featuring" credit (i.e., never a hit of her own)? The only other one I can think of who might be bigger (and it may be after AT40 ended) is L.V., who was featured on Coolio's "Gangsta's Paradise" but never had his own Top 40 hit. I don't know if by classic you mean Casey at the mic for AT 40, or until the end of November of 1991,or January 1995 but I just remembered today that "Gonna Make You Sweat" by C & C Music Factory gave a feature credit to Freedom Williams. "Sweat" was definitely bigger than "Wind", and might be the biggest "feature" single in the first run of AT 40.
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Post by beegee3 on Aug 10, 2013 19:28:40 GMT -5
Freedom Williams is a good one, but if I remember correctly he received featured credits on C+C Music Factory's first three hits, which would take him out of the running for a "single" featured credit . . . he'd have three.
And in "classic Top 40," I was thinking mainly until 1995 when the show first went on hiatus.
Thanks for all the suggestions!
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Post by woolebull on Aug 11, 2013 18:58:26 GMT -5
Freedom Williams is a good one, but if I remember correctly he received featured credits on C+C Music Factory's first three hits, which would take him out of the running for a "single" featured credit . . . he'd have three. And in "classic Top 40," I was thinking mainly until 1995 when the show first went on hiatus. Thanks for all the suggestions! Good point. I went back and reread your question. So I'll add this vignette when I did a little research. On the three C & C Music Factory songs Freedom gets credited for three features, as you said. However, Zelma Davis only gets credit on one..."Here We Go", which went to number three. Actually the whole artist title is, "C + C Music Factory Presents Freedom Williams and Zelma Davis". If you consider "Presents" as "Featuring" as the same, then Zelma and Wendy's only credited songs both reached number three. A great, and fun, question!
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Post by tpanther775 on Aug 11, 2013 19:55:53 GMT -5
Freedom Williams is a good one, but if I remember correctly he received featured credits on C+C Music Factory's first three hits, which would take him out of the running for a "single" featured credit . . . he'd have three. And in "classic Top 40," I was thinking mainly until 1995 when the show first went on hiatus. Thanks for all the suggestions! Good point. I went back and reread your question. So I'll add this vignette when I did a little research. On the three C & C Music Factory songs Freedom gets credited for three features, as you said. However, Zelma Davis only gets credit on one..."Here We Go", which went to number three. Actually the whole artist title is, "C + C Music Factory Presents Freedom Williams and Zelma Davis". If you consider "Presents" as "Featuring" as the same, then Zelma and Wendy's only credited songs both reached number three. A great, and fun, question! They should have credited Martha Wash also. Now, did Zelma Davis actually sing on that song "Here We Go"? For some reason I can't remember if she did. Now I bring up Martha Wash and for what she did for C&C she did for the group Black Box back in 1990. Actually she sued Black Box and C&C Music Factory for not crediting her and she won the lawsuit against Black Box and C&C settled with her and gave her credit. This is one of the reasons why all artists are now credited. That song that she sung was "Strike It Up" by Black Box.
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Post by woolebull on Aug 11, 2013 20:51:43 GMT -5
Good point. I went back and reread your question. So I'll add this vignette when I did a little research. On the three C & C Music Factory songs Freedom gets credited for three features, as you said. However, Zelma Davis only gets credit on one..."Here We Go", which went to number three. Actually the whole artist title is, "C + C Music Factory Presents Freedom Williams and Zelma Davis". If you consider "Presents" as "Featuring" as the same, then Zelma and Wendy's only credited songs both reached number three. A great, and fun, question! They should have credited Martha Wash also. Now, did Zelma Davis actually sing on that song "Here We Go"? For some reason I can't remember if she did. Now I bring up Martha Wash and for what she did for C&C she did for the group Black Box back in 1990. Actually she sued Black Box and C&C Music Factory for not crediting her and she won the lawsuit against Black Box and C&C settled with her and gave her credit. This is one of the reasons why all artists are now credited. That song that she sung was "Strike It Up" by Black Box. It's a great point that I had forgotten about. And I'm not sure how it was listed in 1991 as opposed to now. I am pretty sure (but not certain) that Zelma Davis actually did sing on "Here We Go". As far as I remember about the C and C v. Martha Wash stuff was that it wasn't that Zelma didn't sing with the group, it's that in the video for "Everybody Dance Now" she was lip syncing the part Martha Wash sang. However, on "Here We Go" I think just Zelma sang. Which would be the reason why she only gets credit for the one song. Great point that Martha Wash and her suits against C and C and Black Box (along with Seduction, I think, as well) being the demarcation line between "featuring" and no credit at all. It was right after that that everybody began to get credit.
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Post by tpanther775 on Aug 11, 2013 22:00:11 GMT -5
They should have credited Martha Wash also. Now, did Zelma Davis actually sing on that song "Here We Go"? For some reason I can't remember if she did. Now I bring up Martha Wash and for what she did for C&C she did for the group Black Box back in 1990. Actually she sued Black Box and C&C Music Factory for not crediting her and she won the lawsuit against Black Box and C&C settled with her and gave her credit. This is one of the reasons why all artists are now credited. That song that she sung was "Strike It Up" by Black Box. It's a great point that I had forgotten about. And I'm not sure how it was listed in 1991 as opposed to now. I am pretty sure (but not certain) that Zelma Davis actually did sing on "Here We Go". As far as I remember about the C and C v. Martha Wash stuff was that it wasn't that Zelma didn't sing with the group, it's that in the video for "Everybody Dance Now" she was lip syncing the part Martha Wash sang. However, on "Here We Go" I think just Zelma sang. Which would be the reason why she only gets credit for the one song. Great point that Martha Wash and her suits against C and C and Black Box (along with Seduction, I think, as well) being the demarcation line between "featuring" and no credit at all. It was right after that that everybody began to get credit. Your absolutely right about Zelma lip syncing in the video and that being the reason for the lawsuit. You know as well as I know in 1991 that was a no-no because it was right after the Milli Vanilli fiasco. Same thing went for the Black Box lawsuit. No credit for the song and lip syncing in the video. Black Box had Katrin Quinol and of course C&C had Zelma Davis. Both women were beautiful and had the model figure. Katrin was an actual model. Martha Wash was part of The Weather Girls and was with Sylvester back in the 1970's. She was a heavy set woman but had awesome vocals. But she didn't make for good video material. So I understand the whole deal with the lawsuits. Martha no doubt deserved the credit.
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Post by freakyflybry on Aug 14, 2013 13:13:45 GMT -5
Some big ones from Casey's second AT40 era:
- The Product G&B, who only charted on Santana's "Maria Maria" (#2) - City Spud, who only charted on Nelly's "Ride Wit Me" (#3)
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Post by blackbowl68 on Aug 14, 2013 14:37:42 GMT -5
To my understanding, groups like C&C Music Factory, Black Box, D-Mob, Technotronic, Snap!, and the KLF were meant to have a revolving door of singers and musicians on their records. Featured credits in these instances were meant to showcase a performer they expected to have their own star power down the road.
That wasn't meant to happen for Martha Wash. Her voice was needed but she was wasn't meant to represent with any group's identity. She was just simply upset that her voice was being mouthed by other people in the videos of the songs she recorded on.
The Milli Vanilli situation was completely different as Rob & Fab were credited for singing on songs they didn't actually record. Even 25 years later, Rob & Fab are still considered the face of Milli Vanilli.
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