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Post by BrettVW on Dec 31, 2019 8:59:15 GMT -5
Well, they'd have to own or have the rights to American Country Countdown first. And it appears what has happened is Westwood One still has the rights to ACC content both past and present. But Fitz is taking CT40 to Hubbard, where he currently hosts a morning show and his current countdown. Somewhere in that chain it was decided to discontinue ACC Rewind. It sounds like a decision on the CT40 end of things. The question becomes, does Westwood One control Bob Kingsley hosted ACC content or does that leave with Fitz, Nan, and KCCS?
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Post by Deleted on Dec 31, 2019 9:52:31 GMT -5
Judging by this it appears Bob’s stuff resides with KCCS and Nan.
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Post by BrettVW on Dec 31, 2019 11:09:43 GMT -5
I'd likely agree, although it could also be Westwood One saying "forget it" since Nan and Fitz took CT40 and bailed.
It's interesting that revisionist history is working in the opposite way here as it does for Casey's shows. AT40 revisionist history ignores Casey's Top 40 and acts like Casey hosted AT40 for a long time and then passed it to Ryan. With Bob, it's as if the majority of his career hosting ACC never happened and they are continuing the legendary brand of Country Top 40. In reality both "CT40" shows were created simply as a vehicle for long term hosts of well known programs to keep doing their thing when ABC decided to drop them for a younger, hipper option. They were both wildly successful and outdid their heritage counterparts with new hosts, but they weren't really there to become heritage shows of their own. I'd say the same thing when Bill st James decides to retire from Time Warp. Flashback was and is the legendary "brand" and the show that should go on. Time Warp is the better show with the original Flashback host, but was created simply as a vehicle for Bill St James to keep doing his thing when Cumulus (ABC) decided to replace him with a cheaper option. And like Casey and Bob, Bill has had tremendous success with his second incarnation simply because the listeners and stations want him, regardless of the show name.
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Post by briguy52748 on Jan 1, 2020 12:16:35 GMT -5
I'd likely agree, although it could also be Westwood One saying "forget it" since Nan and Fitz took CT40 and bailed. It's interesting that revisionist history is working in the opposite way here as it does for Casey's shows. AT40 revisionist history ignores Casey's Top 40 and acts like Casey hosted AT40 for a long time and then passed it to Ryan. With Bob, it's as if the majority of his career hosting ACC never happened and they are continuing the legendary brand of Country Top 40. In reality both "CT40" shows were created simply as a vehicle for long term hosts of well known programs to keep doing their thing when ABC decided to drop them for a younger, hipper option. They were both wildly successful and outdid their heritage counterparts with new hosts, but they weren't really there to become heritage shows of their own. I'd say the same thing when Bill st James decides to retire from Time Warp. Flashback was and is the legendary "brand" and the show that should go on. Time Warp is the better show with the original Flashback host, but was created simply as a vehicle for Bill St James to keep doing his thing when Cumulus (ABC) decided to replace him with a cheaper option. And like Casey and Bob, Bill has had tremendous success with his second incarnation simply because the listeners and stations want him, regardless of the show name. The way I read the press release announcing Fitz as host of CT40, it could be interpreted as CT40 was around 45-plus years and Bob was the show’s third host, not even acknowledging either ACC or that show’s other hosts, Don Bowman or Kix Brooks. As for ACC Rewind ... good while it lasted, and captured the heart of country music's explosive growth of the 1990s. I hope a way to resurrect the show can happen, although it's clear "Rewind" is done. Brian
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Post by BrettVW on Jan 1, 2020 13:27:13 GMT -5
That’s how I interpret it as well. But the reality is that more than 2/3 of Bob’s career was hosting American Country Countdown, a show that is still on and very well known.
Hopefully the “powers that be” will find a way to get Bob Kingsley shows available again somehow.
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Post by briguy52748 on Jan 1, 2020 13:35:01 GMT -5
Well, they'd have to own or have the rights to American Country Countdown first. And it appears what has happened is Westwood One still has the rights to ACC content both past and present. But Fitz is taking CT40 to Hubbard, where he currently hosts a morning show and his current countdown. Somewhere in that chain it was decided to discontinue ACC Rewind. It sounds like a decision on the CT40 end of things. The question becomes, does Westwood One control Bob Kingsley hosted ACC content or does that leave with Fitz, Nan, and KCCS? As far as this question goes, I'm not an attorney, but I think it would depend on what sort of legal agreement the Kingsleys/KCCS Productions worked out with Westwood One, ABC Radio Networks (or whatever they're called now), et al. My hunch tells me WWI (or other copyright holders) still own the original content and can use it as they see appropriate. But again, I'm not an attorney nor privy to any arrangements that were made beforehand. It's sort of the same question that dogs a lot of game show fans and the Bob Barker-era of "The Price Is Right." Even though it has been 13 years since he left the show, speculation on the future of reruns of classic programs of the show (on the digital subchannel Buzzr) has run rampant. Years ago, the cable network Game Show Network did not rerun certain older episodes of the Barker era of TPiR (as it is known to fans) because a fur coat was offered/given away as a prize. (Bob is adamantly pro-animal rights and adamantly anti-fur; he was once dismissed as host of the Miss USA Pageant because they gave away furs against his objections.) (FWIW: There has been other fan speculation as to what other episodes are on the "do not rerun" list.) Anyway, when reruns do happen of Barker-era TPiR episodes - they haven't yet and no announcement has been made - fans have wondered how much input Barker has in clearing reruns of episodes he hosted, what legal arrangements he's made for future airings and what happens after his death. This is despite Barker no longer being with Fremantle Media and the show long ago going with a newer host and production team. My hunch is the same thing with Barker-era TPiR - Fremantle owns the show and can rerun any episodes, even those Barker might object to, as they see fit - as it is between Kingsley-era ACC/CT40 and Westwood One ... WWI owns the rights to the original programs, interviews and other material and can do with it as they wish. (Even though it appears that the new Fitz-era CT40 will be including snippets of previously recorded Kingsley-presided over interviews, so some sort of arrangement has I'm guessing been made to keep the material.) Going back to why "ACC Rewind" was cancelled ... probably a number of things, but I'd guess that cross-ownership and "the heck with it" philosophy. As I said before, it was good while it lasted and it captured what country music was all about in the 1990s, but I'm guessing that now WWI will be concentrating on newer projects. Brian
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Post by Deleted on Jan 1, 2020 15:20:23 GMT -5
I always assumed the reason TPIR has never been rerun outside a brief stint on GSN in the 90s is CBS wanting to protect that show from over exposure for whatever reason. There’s no real good reason in an era where everything is practically rerun to death that this one hasn’t seen the light of day outside that time in the 90s I mentioned unless they just don’t want it aired feeling it will negatively impact the current show. If Barker’s wishes were complied with then, there’s no reason it couldn’t be now.
I really think it’s likely Bob’s likeness for lack of a better word is owned by KCCS and that is why ACC Rewind is ending. Otherwise why would WW1 care if some other distribution arm was handling CT40?
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Post by mellongraig on Jan 1, 2020 16:50:36 GMT -5
The nail in the coffin in part was when in 2018 after the site changed to the Cumulus/Westwood One site the replays went to being full and unedited like an original broadcast without scoped ads to inferior versions and having the replays sound like what the radio affiliates were when they carried the show on the weekend (including the commercials). Plus they also restricted the streams to just the US (unless if you had a VPN).
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Post by Deleted on Jan 1, 2020 16:54:25 GMT -5
The nail in the coffin in part was when in 2018 after the site changed to the Cumulus/Westwood One site the replays went to being full and unedited like an original broadcast without scoped ads to inferior versions and having the replays sound like what the radio affiliates were when they carried the show on the weekend (including the commercials). Plus they also restricted the streams to just the US (unless if you had a VPN). That’s not a nail in the coffin. It was a business decision made by those companies and has nothing to do with the show ending.
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Post by BrettVW on Jan 1, 2020 17:06:08 GMT -5
I feel like with a lot of these music shows there are music rights that TV reruns don’t have to deal with. Part of the reason Bob Barker reruns may not air could simply come down to the fact that the show is essentially unchanged but for the host. It still targets the same demographic that watched it with Bob, whereas, for example, AT40 with Ryan doesn’t target the same audience that wants to hear AT40 with Casey.
If Bob’s ACC shows are owned by KCCS and Westwood One has nothing to do with the “American Country Countdown” name they could start a new syndication package with Hubbard. There won’t be a group of Nash Icon stations required to air the show though, so I’m not sure what kind of reception it would get.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 1, 2020 17:40:48 GMT -5
I feel like with a lot of these music shows there are music rights that TV reruns don’t have to deal with. Part of the reason Bob Barker reruns may not air could simply come down to the fact that the show is essentially unchanged but for the host. It still targets the same demographic that watched it with Bob, whereas, for example, AT40 with Ryan doesn’t target the same audience that wants to hear AT40 with Casey. If Bob’s ACC shows are owned by KCCS and Westwood One has nothing to do with the “American Country Countdown” name they could start a new syndication package with Hubbard. There won’t be a group of Nash Icon stations required to air the show though, so I’m not sure what kind of reception it would get. The demo issue might be an issue except there is no concern with Family Feud w/Steve Harvey still very much alive in syndication being rerun what seems like 850,000 times a week on GSN including in the hours you’d expect the current Feud to be airing in local markets. That’s owned by the same company as TPIR, Fremantle. That’s why I said what I did regarding CBS protecting TPIR. I’ll never pretend I understand all of the rules with these syndicated shows. I always assumed the owner of the snow owned the show. I’ve learned in recent years that apparently isn’t always the case. But again, I think for WW1 to cease producing the show now means there’s an element (I assume Bob Kingsleys hosting) they don’t have rights to. Otherwise again, why would they care?
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Post by mellongraig on Jan 1, 2020 18:18:47 GMT -5
I think another theory as to why ACC Rewind ended was that there just wasn't enough stations carrying the show compared to the amount of stations on the retro AT40 shows from the 70s and 80s (and as far as I know I don't think any stations outside the US picked it up).
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Post by briguy52748 on Jan 1, 2020 20:08:01 GMT -5
The nail in the coffin in part was when in 2018 after the site changed to the Cumulus/Westwood One site the replays went to being full and unedited like an original broadcast without scoped ads to inferior versions and having the replays sound like what the radio affiliates were when they carried the show on the weekend (including the commercials). Plus they also restricted the streams to just the US (unless if you had a VPN). That’s not a nail in the coffin. It was a business decision made by those companies and has nothing to do with the show ending. Exactly. This was a business decision, nothing more. Regardless of what the actual reason was behind that business decision, which could be varied and numerous, the fact still remains that "ACC Rewind" is no more. The suggestion (by the guy you're responding to, Paul) that the show's demise was because the audience was disgusted that the shows were edited is pure bulls***. Brian
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Post by BrettVW on Jan 1, 2020 20:23:12 GMT -5
For once we agree 100% Brian. Cheers to the New Year!
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Post by briguy52748 on Jan 1, 2020 20:35:06 GMT -5
I feel like with a lot of these music shows there are music rights that TV reruns don’t have to deal with. Part of the reason Bob Barker reruns may not air could simply come down to the fact that the show is essentially unchanged but for the host. It still targets the same demographic that watched it with Bob, whereas, for example, AT40 with Ryan doesn’t target the same audience that wants to hear AT40 with Casey. If Bob’s ACC shows are owned by KCCS and Westwood One has nothing to do with the “American Country Countdown” name they could start a new syndication package with Hubbard. There won’t be a group of Nash Icon stations required to air the show though, so I’m not sure what kind of reception it would get. I think there's some good points made with the TV vs. radio program comparison. I admit I was trying to compare apples with oranges somewhat. I think that with the 1990s ACC programs that were part of the "ACC Rewind" package, the target demographic was – more or less as I see it – people who enjoy the country music of that era (whether they were around then or not) vs. the country music of today. As far as targeting the same demographic with AT40, yes and no. Yes, in that people who enjoy music of a specific era will defer to their specific host. Then again, the AT40 franchise itself has always targeted the same demographic group (18-34, I'd guess), be it those that were around when the Casey Kasem shows were originally aired or today with Seacrest, just as it is with TPiR. It's just the people who have changed ... and that we've all grown a little older. The TV group may be a little bit different, though. In 1972, when TPiR debuted (and there were more than a dozen game shows airing during the day), housewives made up a large part of the audience. Through the years, that changed, and you're more likely to get an audience of primarily college-aged students, young adults watching and perhaps 55-older. The fact is, housewives went to work; society has changed and – among other reasons – there are many more dual-income or single-parent families than in the 1970s when the show was finding its footing. Brian P.S.: If you think that dude who complains about ACC shows being edited didn't like that, wait until – speaking of game show reruns – he sees some of the editing jobs on Buzzr-aired episodes of 1970s-era "What's My Line" and "To Tell the Truth." But that's another discussion for a different forum altogether.
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